Trouble Automating Backups

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dhunt
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Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:29 pm

Trouble Automating Backups

Post by dhunt » Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:37 pm

I'm having trouble making sure my backup systems are working properly. My IT company has setup an IO safe and Mozy Pro to backup my sever including xray images through Tigerview and it used to backup my old PMS Daisy before I switched to Open Dental. My old PMS (Daisy) would make a backup of its self into the backup folder every night this would then be saved to the IO safe and Mozy. Is there a way to have open dental automatically create a backup into this folder every night? Currently I have to manually use the backup/restore tool to create a backup in this folder every night. What files do others backup when using Mozy or other online backup systems?

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cmcgehee
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Location: Salem, Oregon

Re: Trouble Automating Backups

Post by cmcgehee » Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:21 am

We do not currently have a way to automatically create a backup folder. You could vote on feature request #42 to give some impetus to implement this. Also, you could write a simple script to copy the database files to a backup location. At a minimum you should be backing up the files in your database directory (usually C:\mysql\data\opendental). At a lesser frequency you would also want to backup your images folder (usually C:\OpenDentImages).
Chris McGehee
Open Dental Software
http://www.opendental.com

stjames70
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Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:24 am

Re: Trouble Automating Backups

Post by stjames70 » Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:14 pm

Why backup just databases? I backup my entire server VM nightly to one of three RAID 10 arrays, changing the backup location between the three arrays in an even fashion. This way, I have backups dating back either one day, two days, or three days in case database corruption occurs within those three days.
I once made a mistake formatting my main drive, so I lost a few hours of data, but was able to recover everything within 30-60 minutes (the time it took to copy the uncorrupted VM from the array back to the main drive).
You should consider using VMs because of the ability to back them up fairly quickly and to spool up a backup quickly in case of a catastrophic failure.
In practice, this means you can restart your server in ANY computer which can run your VM. In my experience, Open Dental uses hardware resources so efficiently that you do not need a server grade computer to run it. Any run of the mill Dell with a current generation processor and a large enough HD can be used as a 'server' if you have its VM backup ready to fire up.
As mentioned by other users in this forum, VMs do sometimes have trouble hooking up to external USB devices (i.e. Dexis platinum sensor or intramural cameras), but we are probably talking about a Windows Server 2012 or newer server which needs nothing but a decent (Gigabit Ethernet) intranet connection between it and your workstations. Our workstation have never had any trouble locating the virtual machine Windows Server.

dhunt
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Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:29 pm

Re: Trouble Automating Backups

Post by dhunt » Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:47 pm

Thanks for the responses. I think I understand it now. Basically what my IT people were afraid of (the file being corrupted if copied while in use) cannot happen with the mysql file. So I can use windows scheduler to make a copy of the mysql file and images file into my backup folder.

stjames - as far as backing up my server VM I am not sure I know enough about servers and networks to do this yet (Ive been reading about it in the forums). I just took over my office in November and switched to open dental and I am using the same IT company that has been managing the office for 20 years. We have a dedicated server which has mirrored drives (not sure about RAID) and 12 workstations. When you say RAID 10 arrays are these external hard drives. What size of drive do you need to back up the server?

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wjstarck
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Re: Trouble Automating Backups

Post by wjstarck » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:45 pm

dhunt wrote:Thanks for the responses. I think I understand it now. Basically what my IT people were afraid of (the file being corrupted if copied while in use) cannot happen with the mysql file. So I can use windows scheduler to make a copy of the mysql file and images file into my backup folder.

stjames - as far as backing up my server VM I am not sure I know enough about servers and networks to do this yet (Ive been reading about it in the forums). I just took over my office in November and switched to open dental and I am using the same IT company that has been managing the office for 20 years. We have a dedicated server which has mirrored drives (not sure about RAID) and 12 workstations. When you say RAID 10 arrays are these external hard drives. What size of drive do you need to back up the server?
Your other option would be to just use Carbonite Server. It will automatically backup whatever you select to the cloud, and the server component can handle MySQL databases on the fly. Carbonite is also HIPAA compliant. Furthermore, it backs up changed files continuously in the background, as opposed to some specified time interval. Honestly, I think people make this a lot more complicated than it has to be.
Cheers,

Bill Starck, DDS
Big Idea Software, LLC
Developer, EASy(Electronic Anesthesia System) for Open Dental
817-807-1709
TX, USA

stjames70
Posts: 101
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:24 am

Re: Trouble Automating Backups

Post by stjames70 » Sun Feb 25, 2018 4:55 pm

As far as the size of the RAID 10 arrays I set up, they were 4TB and 10TB in size.

The first array of 4TB was composed solely of 1TB SSDs without a hot spare.

The second array of 10TB was composed of eight 3TB HDs with a hot spare (self-healing array) just in case I did not repair the array fast enough and a second drive was to fail.

Setting this up is not so easy, but once it is set up, the fidelity of the back ups is unquestionable. By backing up whole machines on a nightly basis instead of allowing a piece of software to decide what was incrementally changed leaves much to be desired in my opinion.

Also, have you ever tried to restart a server by importing data back up to a restored server? It is not that easy. You have to load the appropriate programs, the appropriate versions of said programs, and you will most likely have to repoint all your workstation software to find the appropriate new server name and location. I am guessing that if OD has failed, it probably is because of a major hardware failure such as a failing hard drive or other serious hardware issue. That means you are not just losing OD's database, but all the databases for all your other software such as Dexis' database or in our case, our TimeClock database. Is it easy to back up all those databases on an automatic basis? Not always in my experience.

As I said, by backing up the whole virtual machine, the backup virtual machine has the exact same characteristics as the virtual machine that just went kaput. You don't have to load up a new operating system (I assume that you probably only have one copy of Windows Server and that you don't have an extra computer lying around that is fully loaded, up to date and ready to take over if your primary server goes down), install existing software and load back up databases.

I would bet with you that anyone with a virtual machine can restart their office within 30-60 minutes of a disaster, whereas if you had to start from just database backups, we are talking 3-6 hours if you are lucky.

My friend works for Western Union. He told me explicitly that their backup strategy consists of virtual machines that can be spooled up at a moment's notice. They have to have their systems back up and functional within minutes of a catastrophic failure.

Complicated? A little, but nothing that any decent IT outfit can't accomplish for you quickly. Payoff? Peace of mind (priceless)!

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wjstarck
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Re: Trouble Automating Backups

Post by wjstarck » Sun Feb 25, 2018 5:17 pm

I think you’re talking apples while he’s talking oranges

He’s wanting to backup OD and his images, while you’re taking server cloning, which are two different animals entirely.

You also don’t mention anything about offsite backup in your strategy, RAID arrays are fine and dandy (love ‘em myself) but at some point you have to make provisions for taking your *data* offsite. I just didn’t want the OP to get confused
Cheers,

Bill Starck, DDS
Big Idea Software, LLC
Developer, EASy(Electronic Anesthesia System) for Open Dental
817-807-1709
TX, USA

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