Phasing out backup/restore?

[Jorgebon]

I read in the online manual that the backup/restore feature might be phased out because it doesn't have encryption. That's too bad, it's really nice to use for take home backups and it's very easy to restore at home. Other backup software would require that you manually stop the MySQL service before restoring. I really think this should be reconsidered. Most dentists aren't very tech savvy and not giving them a basic backup alternative could result in many of them not backing up at all.
Jorge Bonilla, DMD

[B.Thomas]

I have the same concern about shutting off MySQL to run a backup. I can do it just fine, but I delegate office backups to my staff. They get a little overwhelmed with the Manage>Services>Stop MySQL> Run Backup> Start MySQL instructions. I get a little nervous about them being in the Manage Services window as well. Is there an easier way to do this?

[prav_n]

Whatever solutoin one is using,

I would recommend getting rid of any manual procedures to do backups, it should all be automated using proper backup software (i like carbonite with a scheduled task for the my.

The only thing that people should do is test [quote][/quote]the backup monthly.

Some tools worth mentioning:

http://sourceforge.net/projects/automysqlbackup/
carbonite

[murmsk]

we use mysqladmin for automatic scheduled datadump/backups. This is a free download from mysql. It puts all the data in 1 file which can be restored if needed.

steve

[jordansparks]

Well we can hardly recommend that people run around with unencrypted data on flash drives. That's not HIPAA compliant. And there are so many professional backup solutions out there that it seems silly to try to reinvent the wheel.

[Jorgebon]

I'm trying out the IDrive software that is recommended on the web site. Should I stop the MySQL service when I restore at home?
Jorge Bonilla

[Jorgebon]

OK, I backed up from my office server and then restored to my home laptop using Idrive software. It took a pretty long time since it was the first time. It should go faster when it backs up only the changed files. The restore was a bit tricky since the software assumes that you will be restoring to the same computer you backed up from. You have to make sure you exclude from the restore operation the parent folders that contain Opendental and the A-Z folder, otherwise Idrive will just make a new folder in your home computer were it will restore everything instead of copying to your existing MySQL and Opendental folders. This is too difficult for the average user. I suggest adding step by step instructions on the Opendental website that everyone can follow.
Jorge Bonilla, DMD

[Jorgebon]

Just one thing I didn't like, when you restore at home you have to restore everything instead of only the files that changed.
Jorge Bonilla, DMD

[fishdrzig]

So, what is the deal? In the upcoming versions, will we be able to backup as usual, or do we now have to purchase an outside software to do this?

[jordansparks]

The backup software feature is still in OD as always. We are just being realistic about its usefulness. We are working on a better solution.

[nathansparks]

I always advise OD users have secure, pw protected media for backups if they use the included OD backup/restore. Isn't that HIPAA compliant? For instance the
IronKey product, it is also waterproof and, for added fun, the chip self destructs if it is physically tampered with. Yet once you unlock it, it is as easy to save files to as any other thumb drive.

•FIPS 140-2 Level 3 Validated
•AES 256-bit Hardware Encryption
•Up to 32GB Capacity
•25MB/s read - 17MB/s write (max)

https://www.ironkey.com/demo-personal

[B.Thomas]

Very Cool! We are up to 36 GB with all the photos we take.

[jordansparks]

I did not consider the use of an encrypted USB drive. Based on this new information, I am "phasing back in" the built-in backup feature.

But we are still working on another option. As a completely separate feature, I would like to see:
1. User enters a password that only they will know.
2. Database gets automatically compressed, encrypted, and uploaded to our servers frequently.
3. If user provides their registration number and password they would be able to restore to home computer.

Future improvements:
4. Incremental uploads happen throughout the day for every little change.
5. If user wants certain web services hosted by us, then we would also know the password. This would also allow us to automatically validate backups.
6. Expanded to include images.

[nathansparks]

Fantastic Jordan! Those ideas actually go along way toward relieving the burden of data backup from the dentist who just wants to 'dent'
As to those who have >32GB of data (images of course) the ironkey may not be the solution, I just like the iron key because it self destructs and I think that is cool.
For now, there are many 64GB and a few 128GB usb flash drives, and you can get solid state USB drives also, kingston has a 128 gb thumb drive that is usually in stock and comes with security but not the 256 bit AES, I think that is limited to 32 GB (kingstons 32gb 256 AES is surrently around $750, so you pay for the small package http://www.kingston.com/flash/DataTrave ... rprise.asp)
Here is a link to info about the 128 GB product http://www.kingston.com/press/2009/flash/06b.asp NOTE: Again not 256 bit AES

[Rickliftig]

Jordan -

I, for one, would definitely consider a subscription to that sort of backup option

[jordansparks]

We would probably not charge extra for it unless images were involved. It would take very little space on our servers and it would not require any additional staff time. We would make our profit by giving new users one less reason to not go with Open Dental.

[murmsk]

What a concept .... make money by giving people what they want/need.

Steve

[B.Thomas]

Nathan,

What do you think of an encrypted drive like this for security?

iomega eGo Encrypt Portable 320GB
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... -_-Product

It doesn't have the James Bond self destruct mode but can it be hacked by someone?

Thanks,

[jordansparks]

That cannot be hacked. It's a good solution from a reputable company.

[cneelley]

I am using Version 6.9.11, and am running windows 7 32 bit on one machine, and on another machine, windows 7 64 bit. I have Opendental running as individual servers on each. I can't get backup to work. Opendental has to shut down before completing the task. I read here that backup still works, It does work fine on my xp machine. Seems to have something to do with windows 7.

Dr. Neelley

[jordansparks]

And you are talking about backup, not restore, right?

[cneelley]

Yes, I am talking about backup.

Restore is a whole other issue, but restore works fine if I update from online the server to whatever version the backup was made from. Sure was easier to restore when all I had to do was insert the usb backup media and it would automatically copy the files just like I was at the office and was installing the new version on all of the office machines.

Dr. Neelley

[Jorgebon]

I have version 6.7.30 and windows 7 64 bit in one of my machines. I can do the backup from that machine without problems. One thing I did do that could be different was that I did the backup on an empty USB drive, so it was a completely new backup.
Jorge Bonilla, DMD

[jordansparks]

I don't quite understand. If Open Dental is shut down, then how are you able to use it's backup feature?

[cneelley]

I was not clear. Opendental is running and I hit the backup button to backup opendental to either a 2nd hard drive or a usb drive. It starts to back up but before it can complete the task Opendental stops working and I get an error message saying that opendental must shut down, so the backup is not cmplete. It seems to stop with the database almost or maybe completely backed up, but the a-z folders have not started to back up.

Dr. Neelley

[jordansparks]

And is the location that you are backing up to completely empty? I'm not saying it always needs to be empty, but that would be the first step of troubleshooting. I would focus on only backing up the database, and handling the images manually.

[cneelley]

I have tried it with an empty usb drive and with one where I was replacing the backup. It did not make any difference.

If you can't duplicate this problem, then it must be a problem with my database or computers, I don't know. I won't be using windows 7 at the office any time soon.

Dr. Neelley

[Debbie OD Support]

You can try to manually bring your backup over. Just make a copy of your OpenDentImages and paste it in your USB or removable drive. Same with your database under C:\mysql\data the folder is called opendental. If that works, great. But if you run into a problem doing that, it will give you a better description of what is going on and what might have been the problem with Open Dental trying to do the backup.

[cneelley]

New problem. I backup Opendental at the office on a usb drive and I take it home and restore it on my computer at home, windows 7 32 bit. At home I tried to view an image of one of my patients and opendental gave an error saying that it could not find the image. So, I went into the opendentimages folder and looked for the jpg file. Sure enough, it was in the folder and I was able to open it just fine. Looks like opendental is not communicating with the file folders in opendentimages using windows 7, at least on my machine.

Dr. Neelley

[jordansparks]

I would check your paths again.

[drfredc]

As far as backup restore goes -- STOP REINVENTING THE WHEEL! Focus energy on the dental side of things...

OpenDental could easily offer an link at their website for customers to set up and run various online backup services such as Carbonite to do encrypted, automatic scheduled backups. Services such as Carbonite offer secure backup for virtually unlimited data for $55/year. Open Dental could get a well deserved kickback for offering a Carbonite back link in the full OpenDental management section of the program (or any other online backup service) for a cut in the yearly maintenance ($55/year).

Seems to me if Open Dental direct 1000 customers to Carbonite for $55/year, that ought to be worth at least $5/customer for the referral and the few minutes it takes to set up the code and links.

FYI, for those dentists with web sites you might check your host for backup services. My web host (Ipower.com) offers 2Gs of FREE Carbonite storage with a web domain account. Two gigs is enough storage to cover my 20 years of converted Dentrix > OpenDental data AND 5 years of DEXIS xrays AND some clinic forms/letters AND quickbooks data with more room to spare. Carbonite offers the option to update during the day, or at the end of the day.... It's dead simple, click the link at the ISP to sign up, download and run the Carbonite software, fill in the details of who you are and what to back up, schedule it and you're backed up -- FOREVER. I figure later this year I'll actually spring for the $55 to get a larger backup option as I add more xrays and photos... I'll probably start dumping some other data (like home photos and vids) on the server to back up.

Just a thought...

[jordansparks]

We already do.
http://www.opendental.com/manual/backupsonline.html
The number of customers who have set it up is low. It's the customers who fall through the cracks that are also the ones most likely to lose data. We just had a dentist lose one year of data. Unacceptable. We are not reinventing any wheels here. It's certainly not going to be fancy or configurable. Just quick and simple backup of database followed by automatic validation on our end.

[brentwood]

Hi Dr. Sparks,
I think you should mention Crashplan (http://www.crashplan.com) in that page. It lets you back up to your home computers, external hard drives, other computers in office, their site, and even your friend's computer (you probably don't want to do that). You can back up to multiple locations at the same time. I have been using it for a month now. I cannot say enough how much I love it. Most of the time I restore from my home computer. It is super fast.

I used Mozy before. First of all, the restore is extrememly painful and slow. I have to wait for the email to tell me that a restore is ready for me to download. It usually takes hours. Then, I have to download, unzip it, and copy to my local folder. A lot of time, some of mysql files are missing. I called Open Dental support for this before because I never thought Mozy would be at fault. After I compared the files I got from restore and the files on their server for my account, I found that some files were not zipped up. I cannot believe that they are still in business. If anyone of you is using it, I suggest you run away from it ASAP.

[jordansparks]

Wow. CrashPlan is a really nice program. We're testing the standard version fully before recommending it. Their enterprise version looks very nice as well, and we might consider it for our own corporate data if the standard version testing works out well. Thanks very much for the suggestion.

[brentwood]

Hi Dr. Sparks,
Glad that you like Crashplan and recommend it on that web page. To me, Mozy and Carbonite are inferior products. Their huge and successful marketing makes them popular and successful.

I think the days of having backup on USB drives are over. It should only be used in absolutely needed occassions. I see a discussion on encrypted drives on this thread. I use TrueCrypt (http://www.truecrypt.org/). It is a free software. You don't need any special encrypted drives. You can turn part or all of your USB drive space or part of your hard drive into an ecypted drive. You can even have two encrypted partitions on the same USB drive with different passwords.

I, like other pople, suggest you not spend efforts on developing and hosting a backup solution for OD users. There are many solutions out there. If I were you, I would spend the efforts on improving the product.

[V Suite]

New problem. I backup Opendental at the office on a usb drive and I take it home and restore it on my computer at home, windows 7 32 bit. At home I tried to view an image of one of my patients and opendental gave an error saying that it could not find the image. So, I went into the opendentimages folder and looked for the jpg file. Sure enough, it was in the folder and I was able to open it just fine. Looks like opendental is not communicating with the file folders in opendentimages using windows 7, at least on my machine.

Dr. Neelley

On earlier versions of OpenDental, when I restored from USB to another machine, upon startup OpenDental would prompt to change the invalid data-path. Now, (ver 6.8, not sure about 6.7) it does not.
Workaround: Once you restore to a new computer (most probably has a different name) check the data paths.
Solution: Might this be easily fixed (reverted) back to the previous behaviour, Jordan?